Well, shit
Well shit, that all went extremely pear shaped.
England did to us what we did to Ireland last week, only when we get that dominance up front we score a lot more points. They came out firing and put us on the back foot from the get go then never let up. Massive credit there, that was a huge performance. Have they played their final though?
For us, after the initial onslaught we did somewhat get ourselves back into the game, but just pushed too many 50/50 plays and kept coughing it up at crucial times.
Cane was huge for us last week to nullify the Irish pack in the first 40. He's always been someone that thrives in the tight exchanges early on, so benching him was a pretty baffling decision TBH. SB was OK but Cane provides a point of difference.
I love me some Jordie but he was only meant to be a squaddie. BFA on the bench would have been smart, especially given how early it is in Mo'unga's career. I would have subbed Richie early in the 2nd 40 and put Beauden back to 10. Experience matters in knock out matches and we needed calm heads after going behind early.
I was also surprised we didn't try and play Rieko into some form given how much of a game breaker he is.
But all of that is really just details when the forwards get smacked around like that. The English pack was amazing and Itoje showed just how good he is on the biggest possible stage.
It's been 12 years since we got knocked out of a RWC. I wasn't super confident we could get up a 3rd time, though the Irish game did give me some hope, but at the end of the day England were too good on the night. If you think back to 2015 we struggled to get up for the semi final against an SA team that had just lost to Japan. This time around we hit a far superior side.
So all in all I blame Ireland for losing to Japan and putting us on the wrong side of the bloody draw.
@Kirwan I'm going to the pub later, and half of the people there will be brits. I'm gonna take a lot of shit.
Forwards just outplayed. Sure, we should have started Cane ahead of Barrett, but I doubt that changes anything. Discipline was poor, cost us a faint chance at pulling the game out of the fire. Biggest error though was not having Ben Smith on the bench - should have been BB into 10 and BFA into 15 after about 30 minutes. I like RM, he's come along in leaps and bounds, but he was lost today.
Need to give the reserves a run out for 3rd/4th and make sure we don't lose to Wales (I will be genuinely surprised if Wales beat SA).
@Duluth said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I was more optimistic than that, I am a Blues supporter after all, that helps. I know a few that have been predicting exactly what happened tonight, and picking the Boks to take it out.
I got some good odds on the Boks too
Didn’t want to out you 
I banished the wife, told her they were playing fine when you weren’t watching.
@Duluth said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I was more optimistic than that, I am a Blues supporter after all, that helps. I know a few that have been predicting exactly what happened tonight, and picking the Boks to take it out.
I got some good odds on the Boks too
I hope not, they had a weak draw in the finals for their last rwc win too
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Where’s Stargazer to explain how great Bridge is and how Richie wasn’t a defensive liability?
When Ioane has played a game like tonight, we’ve often heard the “forwards didn’t front, so no space for the wingers” line trotted out. Just sayin ?
@ACT-Crusader He scored against Australia in Perth and was good. Hansen made him a scapegoat to bring in an NPC level player. You're not getting away with that Crusaders bullshit tonight.
@ACT-Crusader said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Where’s Stargazer to explain how great Bridge is and how Richie wasn’t a defensive liability?
When Ioane has played a game like tonight, we’ve often heard the “forwards didn’t front, so no space for the wingers” line trotted out. Just sayin ?
At least when Ioane “plays bad” he still try’s to beat a man on the outside. Bridge is the king of submission.
@ACT-Crusader said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Where’s Stargazer to explain how great Bridge is and how Richie wasn’t a defensive liability?
When Ioane has played a game like tonight, we’ve often heard the “forwards didn’t front, so no space for the wingers” line trotted out. Just sayin ?
Perhaps it was just me, but there seemed to be a lack of support when we pushed the ball out wide.
@MrDenmore said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Wind back 24 hours, start Cane instead of SB; Coles starting instead of Taylor; Bender on the bench instead of Jordie. Would it have made a difference?
Might have kept it closer.
@Tim said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@ACT-Crusader He scored against Australia in Perth and was good. Hansen made him a scapegoat to bring in an NPC level player. You're not getting away with that Crusaders bullshit tonight.
Good? No he wasn’t. He scored when we had front foot ball and we were getting a roll on.
And so much for Paddy T providing impact. Wet lettuce more like it.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Machpants said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Pissed, got in CoD MW, took it out on the bad guys and top scored by miles. BBBR got nothing on my killing rage
That just went way over my head...
Best you watch some Poldark ?
@ACT-Crusader LOL, they brought him on with 10 to go. Maybe they should've played two Scott Barretts?
@No-Quarter said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I was also surprised we didn't try and play Rieko into some form given how much of a game breaker he is.
Was he due to play in the cancelled Italy game?
@Tim said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@ACT-Crusader He scored against Australia in Perth and was good. Hansen made him a scapegoat to bring in an NPC level player. You're not getting away with that Crusaders bullshit tonight.
Would have been a great game to have a player make something out of nothing, with the forwards getting owned. Like Savea and Ioane have done for us in the past.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@No-Quarter said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I was also surprised we didn't try and play Rieko into some form given how much of a game breaker he is.
Was he due to play in the cancelled Italy game?
Geniuses would have probably played him at centre, like for large parts of the previous game. They made their minds up before the WC.
@Kirwan the key word being the past. The very distant past. He hasn’t done any Houdini play for a while. Certainly not this year.
@MrDenmore Nope that is a magnificent forward pack. We cant even look forward to their imminent retirement. Most are still young. They even did brilliant pop passes
@ACT-Crusader said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan the key word being the past. The very distant past. He hasn’t done any Houdini play for a while. Certainly not this year.
And Bridge never has.
Looks like we spent most of our energy last week and were flat asf this week. That and a couple of baffling selections. This is why some of us were hoping for an easy QF so that we could peak for this game. Oh well, no excuses. England were just better but what hurts the most is that we offered nothing.
@Machpants said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Best you watch some Poldark
God no.
Like bloody East Enders with wrong accents and worse plot lines
@Duluth said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Does the press conference get streamed on youtube?
I don't think so. The Stuff live feed usually has comments from the press conference before it appears on YT.
@ACT-Crusader I like Bridge - does the right thing. Covers well. Good skills so he finishes well, It’s always a mix call as to whether you have a game breaker or a team player. Trouble is that our game breakers like Reiko have been average.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Machpants said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Best you watch some Poldark
God no.
Like bloody East Enders with wrong accents and worse plot lines
Haha entirely true. But I do get nostalgic about Cornwall, spent a few years at Culdrose, and family in Coverack and Helston
@BerniesCorner said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@MrDenmore Nope that is a magnificent forward pack. We cant even look forward to their imminent retirement. Most are still young. They even did brilliant pop passes
The ABs attacked the tackle different tonight. We’ve tended to run one low and one high to not allow the offloads, but tonight there was quite a few, one low, and the England fatties were able stand and offload.
Tuipolotu should have been on earlier and Barrett back to 10. Sorry you guys are out. Reffing wasn’t bad. Hope Eng have played their final. If Boks get past Wales and Garces our lineout and direct midfield and loosies. I’m bleak it isn’t going to be ABs and Boks in final....
I don't know how to process this loss. We got out coached. The issues I had with the coaching changes this year and especially this week played out.
Agree with much of what @No-Quarter writes below.
J Barrett was always a potential liability.
S Barrett didn't have a bad game but we needed offensive defence around the ruck and loose forward trio playing the style they'd been playing all year. Cane was never going to be able to add impact as a replacement that compared with what he offered at the start.
I was always on the Rieko train, while still being a Bridge fan, but it's telling that Bridge was replaced by Jordie in this match. Rieko was never as out of form as his detractors on here made out. Not saying he would have won the game but it was these sorts of little coaching decisions above that all contributed to this teams performance. I think a bloody good coach got too tricky in his last hurrah.
@ACT-Crusader WTF are you going on about with Patty T? He was barely on the field. FFS.
@Nepia said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Rieko was never as out of form as his detractors
The weirdest thing on this forum is how people can't wait to bag an Ioane. Remember when video games cost him his career?
@Bovidae said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I didn't want to tempt fate before the game but this was only BBBR's 5th loss for the ABs, and until tonight he had never lost to the same team twice.
So it’s Brodie’s fault then.
@Nepia said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
S Barrett didn't have a bad game but we needed offensive defence around the ruck and loose forward trio playing the style they'd been playing all year. Cane was never going to be able to add impact as a replacement that compared with what he offered at the start.
If the idea of SB was to start the line-out, it didn't work. If the idea of SB was to add some grunt, it didn't work. Not blaming SB as he wasn't the worst out there by any measure.
We needed some mongrel and didn't show any. Pat T had been Kaino-like this year - surprised he wasn't on earlier.
Well that was pretty bloody disappointing. England were great and were far the better team.
I'm not sure it would have mattered too much who was picked for this game. The ABs just looked flat and extremely rattled by the intensity. Somebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
Wasn't just the players being outplayed either Hansen got done big time by Eddie Jones.
We picked a lineout to attack theirs, and then got smashed at it. Totally out thought. We needed Cane badly in that first half. They wanted to get ahead then watch our guys panic, and we did. BB amongst the worst, kicking everything away, but lots of guys trying to win the game in one play. No temperament on display whatsoever. As an aside, fucking terrible cheerleading nz commentary, sickening.
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Where’s Stargazer to explain how great Bridge is and how Richie wasn’t a defensive liability?
Don't think he was around for the Championship final last night either. Not sure which was worst, losing last night or losing tonight. Either way it has not been an enjoyable sporting weekend results wise.